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Post by qcomdrj on Oct 3, 2004 22:39:59 GMT -5
When you admit you're arguing two sides of the same argument. John Kerry. If it's an advantage to Ichiro playing more games in a season with playoffs, it's an advantage to Ichiro playing more games in the same season. Same difference.
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Post by CheesyChaz on Oct 4, 2004 0:15:42 GMT -5
YOU ARE NOT LISTENING TO WHAT I'M SAYING, that is what your problem is, if you actually read what i wrote you wouldn't be making that argument, i'm done with this topic
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Post by qcomdrj on Oct 4, 2004 5:12:06 GMT -5
I've listened to everything you said. You said the season being 8 games longer isn't an advantage. Then you said that counting the playoffs is stupid because there are more games and that would be an advantage. Then you said that they were different eras. When I argued that they were different eras, you said they weren't, because having an old era stat would cheapen Ichiro's.
Your problem is that you can't pick one side and stick with it. And you're only through with the argument because you can't win, because apparently you see it as some sort of mental handicap if you lose.
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Post by GTownWarHawks on Oct 4, 2004 16:02:28 GMT -5
Really, cause playoff stats count for career stats. So why wouldn't they count for the season? Same calendar year and all. So why do you think they shouldn't count? Would the extra games possibly give someone AN ADVANTAGE? Cause I think they would, given some people could play 21 more games. This is the best point I have heard here If playoff stats count as career why not season. Why would they even think like this. the Playoffs are still part of the season. Just because some plays are on better team means nothing. unless there is a race for some hort like the McGwire Sosa hommer race if one of the teams made it and the other no they would just say well he had more games
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Post by CheesyChaz on Oct 4, 2004 16:55:39 GMT -5
this my last post here just to clear up any confusion, i said a regular season is a regular season, it does not matter if there were more games or not in the first place, but even with that you can not say 154 games 84 years ago were at less of an advantage than 162 games right now because we don't know the difference in difficulty so we might as well have one season stat for everything which is what we have now, as for the playoffs, they DO NOT count towards your career stats and are totally different from the regular season hence the name POST season, i said that if this year daren erstad's team was out of the playoffs and ichiro's were in and ichiro got 1 more hit in 18 more games then that wouldn't be fair, but since season stats DON'T count in the playoffs that wouldn't be making any sense as your argument, i trying to be as clear as possible and if you don't agree with me just remember that there is a reason the records are the way it is, some people that know more about sports than you and i combined felt that this was the best and fairest way to keep the records but if you're still not getting it so here's a recap:
a regular season is a regular season
regular season and post season are not the same season
we don't know if 8 extra games really are an advantage
it is most hits in a season not most hits in the least amount of games
and the reason i want to end this is not because i don't have an argument, the reason is that you are never going to give up and you just keep on coming up with dumber and dumber examples and i don't feel like having to respond to them
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Post by qcomdrj on Oct 4, 2004 22:42:32 GMT -5
He's right about postseason not counting for career stats (which is beyond retarded). Apparently Baseball hasn't gotten the memo that people actually play those games too, and should reap the benefits. Even college football counts postseason stats.
My examples aren't dumb, I was just showing that your logic was flawed. It still is.
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Post by tigerbait99 on Oct 4, 2004 22:43:42 GMT -5
Postseason stats should be counted. If someone puts forth the effort, they should always get credit.
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Post by CheesyChaz on Oct 4, 2004 23:38:15 GMT -5
He's right about postseason not counting for career stats (which is beyond retarded). Apparently Baseball hasn't gotten the memo that people actually play those games too, and should reap the benefits. Even college football counts postseason stats. My examples aren't dumb, I was just showing that your logic was flawed. It still is. first of all adding playoff stats to season stats is just plain stupid because they are two seperate seasons, and i say you're not listening to what i'm saying because i've already explained that 21 extra games in the SAME season is undoubtably an advantage and would be really dumb, but 8 extra games compared to 84 years ago is not necessarily an advantage, i don't get why you think it is, and you keep talking about having 2 records but that would be unfair to ichiro, for all we know sisler had a greater advantage because maybe the talent was lower or the style of play suited his type of game, that is why they have the same record for 154 games and 162 games, i don't care if you disagree with me i just want to stop having to say the same thing over and over again, if it's not going to change your mind or if i'm not going to change yourt mind then just drop it, this has gone on far too long and it has gone nowhere
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Post by CheesyChaz on Oct 4, 2004 23:42:31 GMT -5
Postseason stats should be counted. If someone puts forth the effort, they should always get credit. the only problem is that they are individual stats, not team stats, so that means a teams record should have nothing to do with who has the most homeruns or the most hits which would be increased if they got into the playoffs
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Post by qcomdrj on Oct 5, 2004 0:47:32 GMT -5
I don't know that Sisler had an advantage, he did hit .407 that year. There is a reason they named the award after Cy Young. (I know he didn't play in 1920, but still). All I am saying is that they have season records from before 1898 when they went to 154, why not have ones from before 1961 when they went to 162? Lots of columnists compare Ichiro to Sisler, so I don't think either of them would have been incredibly different if they played in the other's era. And apparently the current style of play suits Ichiro or he wouldn't have hit 262 this season. Had he hit .407 he would have blasted the record to bits.
As for postseason stats counting for career stats, it would take making the playoffs every year for 8 years, and playing the full 21 games to equal one more season of regular season play. They should still count for career stats, because the player actually did perform. It seems like it unfairly hurts players such as Jeter who have some pretty good postseason stats, and those mean nothing in the grand scheme.
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